Rod
Thanks for your support. Our posts must have crossed. You'll find a rough, just-get-this-darn-thing-going approach sketched in my previous post on this
subject. (And seeing Eugene's next post, it is almost the Wiki Way, in spirit.)
I might have exemplified things a bit more by referring to http://www.bootstrap.org/dkr/discussion/
There comes up a list of all the posts in Unrev-II. Choose sorting by thread. There you find something that tends to do the job, but still far from
satisfactory. However, the threads are a good aid for the next steps.
I am thinking of splitting the lot up in ten packages of about 400 documents - not in numerical sequence, but in thread-alphabetical sequence so that each
volunteer works with complete threads.
When you click on one of the posts, you'll find a document number in the browser's URL display, the first document being 0000.html
A quick look at the document shows it to be of no value for future reference. Rate the document "R" for reject. By the time one reaches document 0007, you
will find something that perhaps shouldn't be rejected off hand, but is not like of much use for the e-journal. Rate it "?" or "Q"(uestionable). That
reserves it for contemplation later because right now one wouldn't want to bother. After all this is a quick sort.
Come document 0010, in the thread "Better Humans, Better Information Systems," one might give this an "A"(ccepted - for now) and add a classification
comment, such as "society" or "human nature." Don't break your head over which because the lables reflect a kinship. So the rating might be A: society
(human spirit)
Document 0058 in the thread "Towards a DKR" might be rated A: Engelbart or A: DKR or A: OHS
Etc., etc. This part of the process is dull, but fast.
Clearly volunteers doing different parts of the overall heap rate with their own biases, but they shouldn't be all that far apart.
Once all documents have been rated (the A's along with a classification and, perhaps, a comment, "Geez, that's good!") we go to the next phase, which is kind
of harmonizing the classifications, see which heaps need a more refined subclassification before being made available to potential authors to extract
coherent stories about those subjects they might find it interesting to work on.
Typically they might remove extraneous stuff from each posts and put the remainders together into a single document (keeping the post reference numbers in
place because the final story will need to refer to original posts), then edit the story (downsize and shape), perhaps using a tool like Ted Nelson's Xanadu
editor. More about that at http://www.bootstrap.org/colloquium/session_09/session_09_nelson.html
I imagine that in places considerable benefit may be had from notes stored in your SDS. And this in itself should demonstrate a fine application of your
system - a story in itself. In fact, a number of posts may well be classified as SDS (either as a primary or a secondary classification).
Finally, refine style for publication and comprehension by plain folk (wherever possible).
In going through the various topics to be edited for publication, initial preference will be to prioritize items directly bearing on matters Engelbartian,
then on other stuff that strikes us a particularly interesting. Etc.
And as we go we may well encounter someone with a bright idea toward getting results faster into our budding DKR, with less pain.
Volunteers for the first round?
Henry
Rod Welch wrote:
> Henry,
>
> I believe your leadership on this matter deserves support. How many letters
> need to be organized and what is the procedure? Do we need the consensus
> ontology Jack Park called out on 000623?
>
> http://www.welchco.com/sd/08/00101/02/00/06/23/114155.HTM#L362164
>
> Has anyone done anything on this so far to explain the initial subjects you
> want, e.g., what does "societal" mean? Will we be organizing the record going
> forward with these main subjects?
>
> Rod
>
> Henry K van Eyken wrote:
> >
> > Yes, Eric, you are consistent. This follows through on the thread you started,
> > "Recommendations??"
> >
> > At that time I thought of going about things in a low-tech way by rapidly
> > sifting out the chaff from the wheat by a team of half a dozen to a dozen
> > volunteers. Each volunteer might look at a number of threads and sift out
> > those that have no merit of substance other than being social glue. We put
> > those in
> > a pile delicately called (in true Fleabyte tradition) "dandruff," which is
> > defined as the scurf of the scalp.
> >
> > While doing this sifting, the threads that are retained might quickly be given
> > provisional labels such as "OHS" or "societal" or "linguistic" or "site
> > reference," etc. Once all are done, a single person might provide an overall
> > classification (still pretty unrefined) and we can then see if we can get
> > topic-oriented volunteers to take a closer look at areas that interest them.
> > Whatever is labelled "OHS" may be combined with the stuff in the OHS-dev
> > forum,
> > then possibly sub-classified. One classification might be "toward OHS coding,"
> > another "philosophy of OHS architecture," etc. By now we get down to the stuff
> > of articles for the "handbook," to use Doug's term.
> >
> > Similarly, we may identify strains and forcefulness of societal issues. I
> > certainly am looking forward to a listing of topical URLs that we may look at
> > and
> > evaluate for a more organized editorial treatment, etc.
> >
> > I think I have said enough in the way of examples. We avoid a mechanistic mode
> > of thinking, but we may learn from the process what a mechanistic mode of
> > sorting ought be like - a good experience in itself.
> >
> > Many hands make light work. If we have, say, ten volunteers then each one will
> > take a quick look at about 400 posts. Yes, there will be misjudgments, but
> > these will come out and get recycled as we proceed. In the end we shall have,
> > besides a huge pile of dandruff, a lot of piles with good, useable stuff plus
> > the satisfaction that, compared to computers, human minds are not all that
> > bad.
> >
> > I am reminded of the army recruit given the task of putting big potatoes in
> > one pail and small potatoes in an other. The responsibility rested heavily on
> > his
> > shoulders: decisions, decisions.
> >
> > Can we get ten volunteers to spend an evening or two making a couple of
> > hundred decisions. A lousy job, but a great start toward far more interesting
> > preoccupations along the lines recommended by Eric..
> >
> > Please, sign up at vaneyken@sympatico.ca Your reward will be in Heaven.
> >
> > Henry
> >
> > Eric Armstrong wrote:
> >
> > > The thought of mining the archive to produce publications strikes me
> > > as plausible and useful. The process, as I see it, would be:
> > > a) One more editors start "carving out" articles.
> > > b) Said editors start setting down requirements for what they need
> > > to do the job effectively.
> > > c) Developers start providing tools the editors can do to construct
> > > readable documents from the archives.
> > >
> > > There is a lot of learning involved in this process, and it fits Doug's
> > > idea of human-systems co-evolving with technology-systems.
> > >
> > > It's not clear to me how much can be done on a volunteer basis, but
> > > it is interesting to speculate on what kind of "benefit proposition"
> > > might
> > > induce subscribers and advertisers to participate in what becomes, in
> > > effect, a traditional publishing vehicle that uses non-traditional tools
> > >
> > > to create its work product.
> > >
> > > Henry K van Eyken wrote:
> > >
> > > > Last July, the Bootstrap Institute began publishing the e-journal
> > > > "Engelbart in Context," but a lack of active support within the
> > > > Institute made it difficult for me, the Institute's volunteer
> > > > webmaster,
> > > > to sustain it. This is nobody's fault. Beyond Doug Engelbart there is
> > > > only one other staff member, Doug's administrative assistant Mary
> > > > Coppernoll. They are assisted by a number of volunteers who take care
> > > > of
> > > > the Institute's server and do other chores toward furthering Doug's
> > > > aim
> > > > of seeing his Open Hyperdocument System becoming a reality. This OHS
> > > > is
> > > > seen as a tool for more efficiently solving urgent, complex problems
> > > > in
> > > > the private and public sectors of world society.
> > > >
> > > > The Institute has some material support, but is very much in need of
> > > > additional funding. An important source of funding used to be the
> > > > Bootstrap Alliance, a small, international group of stakeholders. With
> > > >
> > > > the enthusiastic help of a prominent volunteer, Jeff Rulifson, a
> > > > vice-president of Sun Microsystems, and Karen Robbins, president of
> > > > Amtech, an attempt is made to reinvigorate the Alliance. Amtech's
> > > > reason
> > > > for being is to create partnerships among private and public
> > > > institutions. Details about the state of the Alliance's affairs may be
> > > >
> > > > found at http://www.amtech-use.org/bootstrap/
> > > >
> > > > On its part, the Bootstrap Institute formally created a Central
> > > > Planning
> > > > Committee on October 10. Committee members are Doug Engelbart, Mei Lin
> > > >
> > > > Fung, Eugene Kim, and Jack Park. The Committee, which reports to the
> > > > Alliance's Board of Directors, chaired by Jeff Rulifson, addresses
> > > > three
> > > > areas:
> > > >
> > > > 1. OHS development framework
> > > > 2. Obtaining grant funding for Bootstrap Alliance for some specific
> > > > programs
> > > > 3. Bootstrap communication
> > > >
> > > > As a consequence, the publishing of the e-journal, although perceived
> > > > as
> > > > valuable, will not be receiving the hoped for minimal wherewithal to
> > > > sustain it. This goes for funding as well as for participation. A few
> > > > days ago, Doug proposed that I proceed with the journal within the
> > > > Bootstrap framework, but editorially independent from it. In practical
> > > >
> > > > terms, there will be no funding for it in the foreseeable future - not
> > > >
> > > > until sufficient grants are, if ever, obtained for the Institute's
> > > > operations.
> > > >
> > > > The editorial independence, which relieves Doug from overseeing the
> > > > e-journal's editorial conduct, comes with a name change from
> > > > "Engelbart
> > > > in Context" to "Fleabyte." The editorial stance remains pretty well
> > > > the
> > > > same, however. It may be summarized as augmenting human intellect or
> > > > thinking with computers. A more detailed statement is found at
> > > > http://www.bootstrap.org/context/archive/eic-3.html#3F
> > > >
> > > > I should emphasize that Fleabyte is intended to address people in
> > > > various walks of life. The study of augmenting human intellect
> > > > embraces
> > > > computer science, psychology (or neuroscience as it is now more
> > > > properly
> > > > named), education, publishing, the worlds of work and of civics.
> > > >
> > > > Question at this point is, can we sustain the publication? Equipment,
> > > > maintenance, essential subscriptions, other literature, telephone
> > > > costs,
> > > > automobile use - all remain personal expenses. More significantly,
> > > > there
> > > > is no funds for attracting editorial material. Can one who does not
> > > > pay
> > > > the piper call the tune? Additional handicaps are my age and limited
> > > > personal skills as well as uncertainty about the Bootstrap Institute's
> > > >
> > > > future. That's the downside. Off hand, we might as well throw in the
> > > > towel right now. But why not first try to fathom what the upside look
> > > > like?
> > > >
> > > > Our Urev-II discussion forum has more than 200 registered members. A
> > > > fair number of members are highly active and have produced a body of
> > > > about 4000 posts, many rich in content and reference material. This
> > > > content bespeaks of an interest fully in accord with the envisaged
> > > > editorial breadth. It also is a motherlode of facts and notions
> > > > waiting
> > > > to be mined and refined for public presentation, i.e. to take another
> > > > step toward becoming useful. Moreover, many references exist that may
> > > > lead to morphing the very nature of publishing the e-journal toward
> > > > becoming a true, Engelbartian DKR (Dynamic Knowledge Repository),
> > > > which
> > > > Doug often refers to as a "handbook.". One aspect of this is
> > > > interactivity among authors and readers - in fact, becoming a
> > > > discussion
> > > > forum raised to a higher degree of lasting utility.
> > > >
> > > > We already have some volunteers as well. Peter Jones, a member of this
> > > >
> > > > forum and formerly a editor and co-author with a big publishing house,
> > > >
> > > > has done a fine job of copy-editing for our journal. Gwen Pariset, a
> > > > lady experienced in project work, has volunteered to become a
> > > > webmaster.
> > > > Lambert Gardiner, formerly professor of psychology and now of media,
> > > > has
> > > > contributed an article and is ready take on an editorial role. We
> > > > still
> > > > have to learn how to more efficiently co-operate in turning out a
> > > > product, but that is part of the birthing pangs of an e-journal.
> > > >
> > > > The editorial approach would be to attract material with an eye on
> > > > forming a handbook. This material would be partly unsollicited, partly
> > > >
> > > > sollicited. Together they make the editorial process one of directed
> > > > opportunism. Which brings us to the next question: Can I count on
> > > > people
> > > > - members of the Unrev-II forum to begin with, but also others as time
> > > >
> > > > goes by - to provide quality, purposefull content? To take the
> > > > contributing seriously?
> > > >
> > > > I'll pause at this point and wait for reactions from this forum to see
> > > >
> > > > whether or not we may have a fighting chance to create a journal,
> > > > experimental and evolutionary in itself, that will further the
> > > > augmentation of human intellect.
> > > >
> > > > Any thoughts? Any specific contributions (academic advisors, subject
> > > > editors, successors to myself, authors, Unrev-II miners, production
> > > > people, etc.)?
> > > >
> > > > Henry
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > >
> > > [Choose from 1000s of job listings!]
> > >
> > > Choose from 1000s of job listings!
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Community email addresses:
> > > > Post message: unrev-II@onelist.com
> > > > Subscribe: unrev-II-subscribe@onelist.com
> > > > Unsubscribe: unrev-II-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> > > > List owner: unrev-II-owner@onelist.com
> > > >
> > > > Shortcut URL to this page:
> > > > http://www.onelist.com/community/unrev-II
> > > >
> > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
> > >
> > >
> > > Community email addresses:
> > > Post message: unrev-II@onelist.com
> > > Subscribe: unrev-II-subscribe@onelist.com
> > > Unsubscribe: unrev-II-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> > > List owner: unrev-II-owner@onelist.com
> > >
> > > Shortcut URL to this page:
> > > http://www.onelist.com/community/unrev-II
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > [Choose from 1000s of job listings!]
> >
> > Choose from 1000s of job listings!
> >
> >
> > Community email addresses:
> > Post message: unrev-II@onelist.com
> > Subscribe: unrev-II-subscribe@onelist.com
> > Unsubscribe: unrev-II-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> > List owner: unrev-II-owner@onelist.com
> >
> > Shortcut URL to this page:
> > http://www.onelist.com/community/unrev-II
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
> Community email addresses:
> Post message: unrev-II@onelist.com
> Subscribe: unrev-II-subscribe@onelist.com
> Unsubscribe: unrev-II-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> List owner: unrev-II-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
> http://www.onelist.com/community/unrev-II
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~-->
Get your FREE VeriSign guide to security solutions for your web site: encrypting transactions, securing intranets, and more!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/UnN2wB/m5_CAA/yigFAA/IHFolB/TM
---------------------------------------------------------------------~->
Community email addresses:
Post message: unrev-II@onelist.com
Subscribe: unrev-II-subscribe@onelist.com
Unsubscribe: unrev-II-unsubscribe@onelist.com
List owner: unrev-II-owner@onelist.com
Shortcut URL to this page:
http://www.onelist.com/community/unrev-II
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.0.0 : Wed Oct 24 2001 - 05:57:02 PDT